ways to organize related code in a form?

[Anders Melander 1638]

1 hour ago, Stano said:

I have always thought differently than the general population. That's why I've always been considered a weirdo. Now I take offense if someone tells me I'm normal

A psychoanalyst would have an opinion or two about that statement. I'd say you've integrated your weirdness nicely

 

1 hour ago, Stano said:

High IQ means nothing.

That's a pretty unnuanced statement. I'd say it has a more narrow meaning than what most people think,

 

The rest of your post made little sense to me.

 

Regarding IQ and "intelligence" I would recommend this book:

https://www.amazon.com/Intelligence-Reframed-Howard-Gardner/dp/0465026117

or any of his other books on Multiple Intelligences.

[Mike Torrettinni 198]

21 hours ago, David Schwartz said:

I mentioned that if they knew what these things were back when I was in school, they probably would have diagnosed me with ADD and/or ADHD.

It's fascinating how many kids go through forced medication for false diagnosis. You, luckily, escaped it 🙂

[Stano 140]

Quote

The rest of your post made little sense to me.

Typical for me. I wrote it very wrong. It was supposed to be in the sense: The importance of IQ was greatly overestimated. He is not given much importance now. More emphasis is placed on the overall "personality" = IQ + EQ +? Q
Thanks for the link, but I'm not so interested in it.

[Pat Foley 50]

Again thanks, It very big of you to point it out and share. Its odd to just listen first for a change.     

[David Schwartz 415]

13 hours ago, Stano said:

I have always thought differently than the general population. That's why I've always been considered a weirdo. Now I take offense if someone tells me I'm normal

I've heard people ask me why I'm "so different" all my life. "Why can't you just go with the flow" or "be more flexible" or ... whatever.

 

I don't know why people think that.  But TBH, I'm a lot more tolerant of personal differences today than I was in my youth.

 

If the past 5 years of American politics has done anything, it has shown how lazy so many Americans are and how willing they are to turn their minds over to others. Critical thinking seems to be a lost skill here among about 1/3 of our population. Maybe it has always been missing, but the past 5 years have certainly made it visible.

 

Anyway, this is actually getting me kind of excited in a strange way. I've had lots of bosses and work colleagues who have all formed similar opinions of me throughout my life, which tells me they've all got similar expectations about how people are supposed to be and act "normally". Now I have a reason or excuse to offer that gives them permission to relax their expectations and readjust how they look at me. I do that naturally because I see everybody differently anyway. It took me a while to realize that most people do NOT think that way!

 

The more exciting thing is this: To me, everybody has their own unique strengths and weaknesses. I've certainly got mine. But managers in this field (if not in general) tend to think that "all programmers are equally skilled for all tasks". This is utter bullshit, and I've seen it lead to an unbelievable amount of mistakes and shoddy work. Most people are happy to have a job and won't speak up. I do, but it doesn't really accomplish anything -- this attitude is very hard to crack. But now it looks like I have some leverage to use to make a viable case that I REALLY DON'T "fit the mold" that their expectations are based on.

 

Managers everywhere will stand up and beat their chests shouting about how they're willing to do anything to support their people and help them be as productive as possible. It's all a show. Maybe one or two whom they've known for a while, but not the entire team. Especially the newbies. You've got to learn to "fit in" first. For some of us, that's a non-starter. We know it, but if we mentioned it up-front, we'd never get hired. 

 

But you know what? When you mention you have been diagnosed with something, and there's a law that says they actually have to do what they like to shout about in public to accomodate it, their tune changes. (I don't have personal experience with this, but I've had several friends who've told me about their own experiences.)

 

It totally sucks that these folks simply don't do what they like to say they're committed to doing, and it takes the weight of potential legal action to get them to really do that. 

 

But ... should I really care?

 

There are programming things I'm really good at, and things I really suck at. They don't want to hear it because their overarching belief system is we're all equally skilled.

 

Except now I will have a standardized diagnosis from some outside authorities who SAY IT AIN'T SO for me. WOO-HOO!

 

It makes me wish I had another 20-30 years to work just to see where this could lead. 🙂 

[Stano 140]

I cross my fingers for you. Seeing you work for yourself. Hat down.
With great respect, I will announce Stano

[Pat Foley 50]

Quote

It makes me wish I had another 20-30 years to work just to see where this could lead.

You could. Deming worked on papers and was to present one at 92.   

 

Jerry Pournelle when he worked in the Aerospace industry said they hired people of lower intelligence to connect the wiring harnesses in airplanes since they could focus on this mind numbing work and were happy to do it. 

 

I was at a conference at a state where a company interned high teachers vs students so the teachers would know what to teach and the importance of the students knowing communication skills.  The goal is educate locally not pay finders fees and bonuses for someone that's homesick no matter what the bonus is. 

[Guest]

I see that in this forum, or specifically, in this post, I am the most different (strange, clueless, out of breath, lost, etc ... as you want to call it) of all.
The topic started with a direction, and now, the direction is almost a congress of mental medicine ... I think I need an analyst (head).

 

Anyway, let's try to enter this congress ...

 

Standards and Non-Standards !!! That is the question!

 

First, have you noticed or witnessed people who, after an abrupt jump in their lives, for example, became millionaires, start looking for patterns in a society (the same one they have always lived in since their birth)?

 

To seek, first of all, for having a healthier life --- they want to live more, as if this were a matter of wanting and being at the pleasure of the choice of the human being.

 

I met a gentleman who lived 104 years, where: he smoked, ate fatty foods, drank socially, and, he had already left behind 3 wives (they died), and his newest partner was under 25, and, he had a child with her at the age of 100 ... that's really true!

 

Then, look for a circle of friendship better suited to your new social status ... however, you are locked up in your castle, better to stay in the privacy of your fortress.

Then, look for a job that makes them feel useful, but without much effort ... no stress, it hurts the heart.

And they go looking and finding ... looking and finding ...

Until one day, they realize that they are tired of everything they sought so much ... They go into depression!

Now, it's time to look for a soul disease specialist!

 

However, they do not think of getting rid of everything they find throughout their search life ...

 

So, what standard do human beings really need to fit into?

Now, life is rich and rich. We have many friendships, work, goals ... We are required at all times, we have the attention we had dreamed of before.

But, with all this that surrounds us, we feel drowned in despair, never felt before.

 

Yes, before:

• we were poor, but we had happy and sad moments, why not ?;
• we worked in a service without notoriety;
•  the salary was enough to be awake the other day to get back to work;
• friendships, yes we did ... but there weren't so many in so many places (cities, countries, etc ...);
• goals, yes we did ... survive at any cost;
• standard, hmmm ... did we have any? Certainly, yes. But it didn't matter so much.

Thus, if we check our work environment, today and yesterday, we always act the same way!

• If we are a bathroom cleaner, we are charged by the head of cleaning.
• If we are the head of cleaning, we are charged by the sector manager ... and so on.

All of this leads me to a question:

• Who taught us this charging pattern?
• Was it the mere caprice of being different from others, or, a natural property of human beings?

The man is born a child ... he needs the care of those who were already here.
The man gets old ... and continues to need those who will live here.

Edited December 24, 2020 by Guest

[Pat Foley 50]

11 hours ago, emailx45 said:

The man is born a child ... he needs the care of those who were already here.
The man gets old ... and continues to need those who will live here.

   From diaper to diapered.   What happens in between is accommodation by family, teachers, management, and the State.  A good manager accommodates his charges needs.  Consider the companion animal needed not needed.  I mentioned to the boss of all the shops I worked at this was the only shop that did not have pets.  More toilets can't be installed since the State requires new toilets to meet  accommodation laws. 

 

  The cost of Knowledge is angst.  Being able to share knowledge eases that angst  

 

    

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Pat Foley said:

 From diaper to diapered. 

That was what I meant, in summary, to say!
We age the body and the mind, but the needs are still the same ... we need attention and get noticed, somehow!

 

[Guest]

In the world of technology, the same thing happens!
At all times, we learn about ultra-advanced techniques / technologies, which encapsulate everything that was previously difficult to plan and produce, new concepts are formed, new methodologies of use are presented, new ways of dealing with a problem, previously almost insoluble, etc .. etc .. etc ..
In the end, we have professionals and users anguished because everything seems "so slow" today ... yesterday, it seems that the execution of this application was faster ...
Ah! My phone has 20GB of RAM and 300GB of space ...
Mine, it's only 2GB, and the space is almost running out ... I think I need a 16GB SDCard ...
My code is advanced, I have an impeccable syntax, I was even congratulated by the magazine "Fabulous of Technology and Programming". Today I am an accomplished man ... hmmm, but I could improve that line of code on the X89-abc-20y.pas unit ...
That is, it is never enough! It never ends, and we live chasing something that will be impossible to reach or even get close to.
However, it is necessary to survive! And in the meantime, we are producing something useful or useless.
Always hoping to be, the one, the best for that moment.
If only for 1millisecond.

[David Schwartz 415]

On 12/22/2020 at 11:33 PM, David Schwartz said:

It makes me wish I had another 20-30 years to work just to see where this could lead. 🙂 

Let me clarify this... I don't want to work in the same conditions I've been working in for the past 25 years where I'm mostly maintaining legacy apps. I do want to keep working, but at a level better suited for my natural skills.

 

I'm very creative by nature. My mind easily handles "big picture" concepts and I'm not good at reading code to reverse-engineer it just to fix some weird bug someone made 15-20 years ago. It bores the hell out of me. BTW, I've heard this is common for people with Asperger's. 

 

I've heard managers say, "Everybody [ie., all programmers] love working on new code! Of course! But most of what we have is not that. So just do what's here to do and don't complain!" That has not been my experience, but I'm not really in a position to argue it.

 

What I can say is this:

 

First, some people are far better at reading code and absorbing it into their head like a sponge. I've known several who, after a few minutes flipping page to page, they challenge you to ask them anything and they can find it in a minute or so. I'm no good at that until I reach the point where I've spent so much time pouring over the code that I know it as if I wrote it myself. And if I don't keep swimming around in it, those details fade pretty quickly.

 

Second, I have met very few people who have the mental ability to deal with high-level abstractions on any kind of scale. I've come to believe that software architecture is more dependent on innate mental abilities than anything you can learn. This is something I've always been great at, but not something most employers have ever cared about. They want low-level coders who can find needles in haystacks by reading through reams of code that's been running for 10-20 years.

 

I don't say any of this as a judgment -- some people are naturals at writing fiction stories, and others can barely write an entry in a diary. Some people are great at math and working with numbers in their head, and others struggle to add 2+2. It's just how their mind works.

 

If you need someone who's great in math, you don't just assume everybody is equally skilled in math just because they made it through college. Why do people think all programmers have the same level of skills, from lowest-level to highest? It's silly to me, and very counter-productive in reality. 

 

One thing I struggle with is generics, recursive algorithms, and pretty much anything that has a layer of "meta-coding" to it. I don't know why, it's just the only place I've ever had trouble grasping computational concepts.

 

Everybody has some innate skills where they're really great, and others that constantly challenge them. That's not to say that with enough practice and work you cannot overcome some of those barriers, but they just show up along the way and many folks simply avoid them.

 

It reminds me of the 80's when C++ and OOP were just getting going. A rule of thumb was that experienced C programmers would take 6-9 months before their thinking shifted and "OOP thinking" became a natural thing. It took me about 7 months, and that shift happened in an instant one day. Poof! Suddenly I looked at programming differently. It was a very noticeable and mind-altering event.

 

Anyway, this is stuff I've been aware of for years, and have fought against my whole career. But I'm feeling reenergized now that there may actually be a specific thing that can be pointed to that people who literally cannot get inside my head to observe how I think can use to realize that maybe these things that have been assumed to be "universal skills" really are not. This situation presents some interesting opportunities.

 

 

[Guest]

I think that the classic training required by companies is the result of the fear of making mistakes and having an elephant in your hands to pass through the eye of a needle.

 

I see that human skills are always at the level of unconsciousness, and are revealed in the face of unusual situations where anyone can, without knowing for sure, answer them effectively.

 

This can be seen in everyday situations ... at a certain moment, you find yourself doing something you never dreamed of doing.

 

Some have gone through this moment, and after a relaxation of thought, they will not even remember what happened. Others will have a fixation for the search for the answer to what happened.

 

So, it could be the behavior of the human brain.

 

School education, until it ends in college, can give the individual the means to sharpen this awareness that has not yet been revealed.
It is true that there are many people who have the so-called "divine gifts", which, for most, are called "geniuses".

 

But, what would a genius really be?

 

A brain that is still gross, and that, over time, will reveal itself to the individual? Or, a trained brain, and, at all times, is impatient with the latest discovery?

 

Really, I dont know!

 

Thinking a little more, I think that "normals" should be the "geniuses" announced. And, being "non-genius", should be considered abnormal. For, the source of knowledge is not in the accumulation of knowledge, but, for me, it is in the unanswered answer. Which will lead me to say that the source of knowledge is infinite and unattainable.

 

Some tends to be diamond, while for others, it is enough to know how to polish it with wisdom, so that it will shine even when it is possible to shine.

 

I remember an article (in 2018 if I'm not mistaken) in which the head of IBM made a call to the brains that existed around the world, however, she did not have a formal college diploma.

 

Why you don't need a diploma to work at IBM

https://exame.com/carreira/por-que-voce-nao-precisa-de-diploma-para-trabalhar-na-ibm/

Quote

About a third of IBM employees did not graduate from university

 

Has anyone ever wondered why a 9-year-old hacker breaks into a company like Microsoft, Apple, Nasa, etc ... without having any formal school apprenticeship?

 

Here in Brazil, we had a case in which a 12 year old boy was invited by NASA to explain how he managed to get into one of their systems ... and there was more than 30 years of this revelation.

 

From hacker to NASA speaker, Brazilian will be at the party for the 50th anniversary of the arrival of man on the Moon

https://g1.globo.com/ciencia-e-saude/noticia/2019/07/15/de-hacker-a-palestrante-da-nasa-brasileiro-estara-na-festa-dos-50-anos-da-chegada-do-homem-a-lua.ghtml

Quote

"Eles ligaram para meu pai, dizendo que haviam descoberto a invasão", recorda ele. Wanderley de Abreu, o pai, um engenheiro do Exército brasileiro, assustou-se com o telefonema. Deu bronca no filho, disse que ele seria preso ou, na melhor das hipóteses, jamais poderia pisar em solo norte-americano.

 

Edited December 26, 2020 by Guest

[Stano 140]

7 hours ago, emailx45 said:

Has anyone ever wondered why a 9-year-old hacker breaks into a company like Microsoft, Apple, Nasa, etc ... without having any formal school apprenticeship?

Because these people have no mantineles in their heads. Their mind / thinking is unlimited. This is the most beautiful thing for children. That's why I love them very much All of them!
He didn't know it was impossible, so he did it.
If you want to achieve something, you have to leave your truth!

[Guest]

And, how about this story by Tony Ciccoria (American and orthopedic doctor by profession, until then, without any knowledge of music or even piano) who finds himself a musician after being the victim of an electrical outbreak of nature (lightning)?
The case was studied by doctors in the field of Neurology ...

 

Can't it be more evidence of our natural unconscious genius?

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6179476/

https://www.bbc.com/portuguese/geral-54846294

 

NOTE: Naturally, we must take into consideration some cases of quackery !!!

[Guest]

Here we have a popular saying:

• (of) Doctor and crazy, everyone has a little!

Edited December 26, 2020 by Guest